Anti-God Starbucks Cup has Customer Steaming

28% percent of me agrees with this woman.

Heh heh...

"You will meet a tall, dark , handsome atheist"

Dang!

Lawsuit!

Hello and goodbye. I don't expect you'll last long around these parts.

There probably are, but Starbucks is business, and they are under no obligation to remain neutral about religion (even though they really are). What's surprising here isn't that someone complained, but that a supposed "news" site is taking it seriously. The quote wasn't in any way offensive, and it's one of many different viewpoints presented. What she's pissed about isn't that Starbucks has a position (they don't) but that they're not promoting her viewpoint exclusively.

Oh, so its ok to be intolerant god person because an atheist might be intolerant as well?

This isn't the only quote they use. A popular one I see very often is from Jonathan Wells, the creationist/Intelligent Design advocate, and fellow at the Discovery Institute. This isn't really news, except that someone threw a fit over it.

The Way I See It #224
Darwinism's impact on traditional social values has not been as benign as its advocates would like us to believe. Despite the efforts of its modern defenders to distance themselves from its baleful social consequences, Darwinism's connection with eugenics, abortion and racism is a matter of historical record. And the record is not pretty.
– Jonathan Wells, Biologist and author of The Politically Incorrect Guide to Darwinism and Intelligent Design.

People are too easily offended.

I'm a Christian and even I would be offended if my starbucks cup said "Jesus loves you and died for your sins."

Now if it said "In the Christian faith, believers assume that Jesus is the son of God and that he rose from the dead. They believe that Jesus died for the sins of the world" I woulnd't have a problem with that.

And I agree with the starbucks cup...too many people are dependent on God to tie their shoes in the morning. I personally think God sits up in Heaven and thinks "good grief, can these people do NOTHING for themselves!?"

Tom, that happens all the time; in fact, most every day we are bombarded with religious messages, but we KNOW that people can be religious and we ignore it. Unless they try to force us into believing it. There's the difference.

I just won't patronize a coffee shop unless their cups have pictures of midget group bondage scat bestiality.

Uh,
I believe you meant to say "little people" bondage scat bestiality;
otherwise it's humiliating to the object of the person having poo thrown at them while they're tied up and having sex with a donkey.

What she's pissed about isn't that Starbucks has a position (they don't) but that they're not promoting her viewpoint exclusively.

Actually that's not true. She said, I don't think there needs to be religious dialogue on it. I just want coffee. She's just fine with no position at all.

Oh yeah, sorry greck. Tell your mom I apologize.

*ducks thrown coffee cup

There are in fact counter-examples.

In-And-Out Burger prints references to bible passages on their food wrappers and containers.

From Snopes.com:

[EXCERPT BEGINS]
These mysterious markings are pointers to Biblical passages. Those easily disturbed by the presence of Bible verses need not fear for their souls, however: The text of the passages themselves are not spelled out on the cups and wrappings; only their notations appear there.

In-N-Out Burger was founded by Harry and Esther Snyder in Baldwin Park, California, in 1948. Although this chain of west coast hamburger restaurants has since grown to more than 140 outlets, control still rests in the hands of the Snyder family. According to the company's web site: "In-N-Out remains privately owned and the Snyder family has no plans to take the company public or franchise any units." The Snyders are a religious family, and their continuing to control their own company means they can put what they want on their product packaging. They've chosen to include pointers to particular Bible verses that we presume hold special meaning for them.

The soda cup bears the notation John 3:16:
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

The milkshake cup lists Proverbs 3:5:
Trust in the Lord with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.
The hamburger and cheeseburger wrappers point to Revelation 3:20:
Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

The wrap used for the "Double-Double" (two burger patties and two slices of cheese) lists Nahum 1:7:
The Lord is good, a strong hold in the day of trouble; and he knoweth them that trust in him.

[EXCERPT ENDS]

Alaska Airlines places a scripture card on every meal tray.

Scriptural references are also commonly seen on commercial trucking rigs, on some menus, and other printed materials and/or signage owned by businesses.

(I'd post links, but they're scrubbed from the comments box.)

All of these are generally protected, even though atheists have complained about them. I don't see how Starbucks would be any different.

I personally think God sits up in Heaven and thinks "good grief, can these people do NOTHING for themselves!?"

Soo, true. I completely agree.

Yes, but In and Out Burgers are soooo good (I'm drooling right now just missing them, damn my geographical distance from that Calif. chain!) that I can overlook their quotes.

But seriously I have to applaud Starbucks for at least trying to provide some diverse thoughts.

I'm confused. Are you against free speech? Based upon your sarcasm it kind of looks like it.

Tom, seriously, how many businesses have religious messages or icons on display, or even go so far as "bless" their customers? Aside from occasional private grumbling, how many atheists have you heard of that have gone screaming to the press or sued or anything like that?

There's an enormous difference between complaining about a message, one of many, printed on a cup distributed by a private entity, and, say, placing the Ten Commandments in a courthouse or something state-sponsored.

The quote from that particular cup isn't even that strong, it says there may not be a god and that humans create most of their own problems. By this woman's logic, atheists should be going ape@!$%# every time they find a Gideons' Bible in a hotel room.

Anyway, who cares how many atheists are intolerant or hypersensitive? That's a red herring. If every atheist were a bloodthirsty bigot, would that make this woman's complaint any more valid? I think not.

how many businesses have religious messages or icons on display, or even go so far as "bless" their customers?

Haven't you ever looked at your money?

Tom,

Think if Jesus were walking around physically today. Do you think he'd be going around saying "I'm so damned tired of those business squishing out Christianity! Why!? I'm going to only drink my milk from a Christian cow, eat only from Christian restaurants and buy my merchandise from a Christian store. That'll show'em!"

How much do you want to be if Jesus was around when they lady blew a gasket over some words that Jesus would have told her "my friend, it's only words. You can still believe in God and no one is going to stop you. Don't worry over trifling things and instead go help someone today, feed a homeless person, make up with the person you have anger towards. My friend, today is a big day, this cup is of no concern for you"

Tom you should really focus your energies elsewhere and not worry about a cup.

Think if Jesus were walking around physically today. Do you think he'd be going around saying "I'm so damned tired of those business squishing out Christianity! Why!? I'm going to only drink my milk from a Christian cow, eat only from Christian restaurants and buy my merchandise from a Christian store. That'll show'em!"

Maybe, but he wouldn't be a Christian (a follower of Christ). And cows can't be Christian any more than shops can.

far2old4this,

First. I like your screen name.

Second. Yes, you pointed out the obvious in my statement. So let me recap my theme that I was trying to get at:

It is my opinion that Christians today are far too concerned about Christendom and not Christanity.

sthig,

may I be the (insert digit(s)) to compliment you on your screen name also.

I have no problem with Christians, just evangelical ones.

Allow Satan into your life! Feel his love for you! Oh Yeah!

Allow Satan into your life! Feel his love for you! Oh Yeah!

I have a story for you about the word, Satan. I was born with dyslexia and still have issues with it in my adult life. So even til this day, when I see the word "Satan" it always registers as "Stan" to me (and visa versa).

So that said "GET THEE AWAY FROM ME, STAN!"

Or, if a business owned by Christians or Jews operates in a faith-friendly environment, you all will be very supportive of that business owner's rights.

That's the funny little thing conservatives don't acknowledge: If a religious institution was censored, the ACLU would be the first organization to step in and sue for their rights, as they should. But to answer your question, yes I would be supportive.

I think Tom is under the impression that the suits brought by atheists against religious people are about censorship of free speech. If you actually look at those suits, though, you'll find that nearly all of them are either discrimination cases (you can't legally discriminate for jobs based on religion) or church/state issues (the government has no such freedom of religion). Private businesses are allowed to have a religious position, though, and I support that right, as does the ACLU.

Or, if a business owned by Christians or Jews operates in a faith-friendly environment, you all will be very supportive of that business owner's rights.

Like Chick-Fil-A? The only time I'm not supportive of Truett Cathy's rights is when I want to get a chicken sandwich on Sunday.

By the way, I've met Truett Cathy and he's a nice guy. I don't have ALL my facts here but I believe he said in his book the reason he doesn't do chicken on Sunday is because it was because of business and not a religious one.

Also, I do like Chick-Fil-A's set up, they seem to have the right balance of business and faith.

So that said "GET THEE AWAY FROM ME, STAN!"

A looooong time ago a Christian in Holysmoke said "satin" wanted your soul. It deteriorated from that.

So she went to a newspaper because ... why again?

A better question is, why the @!$%# did the newspaper not tell her to grow the hell up and quit wasting reporters' times.

Because it's news? The mere fact this seed has so many responses is proof there is reader interest.
And it's not every day something like this happens - usually the complaint is the opposite (religious messages at school, on money, on cups, etc.)

It's like the saying goes, "When a dog bites man that's not a story. When a man bites a dog now THAT is a story."

Sounds like this lady is a biter.

Because it's news?

No.

The woman suing or something would be news. A woman being angry is not news. This is the newspaper making the news, not reporting it.

The mere fact this seed has so many responses is proof there is reader interest.

No.

This is the juvenile, laze approach that media outlets use to justify covering irrelevant drivel such as the Anna Nicole Smith saga while overlooking things that actually matter. That you and millions of other Americans don't ask for more from the media saddens and scares me. There's a reason newspaper readership all across the country is plummeting, and it's not just because of the Internet.

Actually I'd say the fact the store had that message on the cup was news and her reaction to it was news. A good reporter could check to verify that those messages are probably against some kind of company policy.

This is the juvenile, laze approach that media outlets use to justify covering irrelevant drivel such as the Anna Nicole Smith saga while overlooking things that actually matter. That you and millions of other Americans don't ask for more from the media saddens and scares me.

If you're going to insult me and others you might want to know more about me first. You have no idea what I do and don't ask for the media. I write media stories all the time complaining about areas in which they could - no, should - improve. So please don't do the type of generalizing, and if you do act better-than-I than at least spell-check to spell "lazy" right.

There's a reason newspaper readership all across the country is plummeting, and it's not just because of the Internet

You're saying it's not because I left the journalism profession?

Oops, one correction: I just re-read the original story and see the message was not from some lone employee but part of a company decision. In that case the story would be fall-out from the company decision to promote diversity of opinion.

To get back to your question about how someone being angry can be a story?
If someone walks out of city council meeting upset over over an invocation do you think that could be a story? Or a person refusing to do the pledge who then starts yelling about it?
It doesn't have to reach the point of a lawsuit or police action to become news.

Ok, maam here's your drink:
"Double mocha, double caffeine, heavy on the god-loves-you message."
How much you want to bed she would take the drink but leave no tip?

Figures this would happen in Dayton.

Why? What's wrong with Dayton? Seriously I'm lacking in Dayton knowledge.

It seems that a lot of people feel that they have a right (God-given?) not to be offended.

No, but when they are offended, they have the right to choose another coffee shop. It's not good business practice to offend your customers. Or as they say, the customer is always right.

They can say that all they want. It's never something I've subscribed to though. :)

Of course, there area ways of saying, "Sorry, you're wrong," and then there are ways, if you know what I mean.

Why? What's wrong with Dayton? Seriously I'm lacking in Dayton knowledge.

I went to the University of Dayton, so I lived there for a while [well, in Oakwood - I value my life]. Dayton consistently ranks in the top 10 most dangerous cities of its size. Further, it may as well be in the bible belt as far as these kinds of things go. On top of that, it's just a boring place to be.

sthig, you hit on something. It's far easier to pick on trifling matters than to really get up your butt and do something good for the world.
christians who waste their time with this want to call attention to their christianity - oh, look at me; I'm a God warrior, fighting for my religion...meanwhile, it serves no purpose and helps no one. She could, as you say, volunteer her time, but no.....................

I think thou doest generalise too much. There are Christians who complain about there being no decorations, about a lack of Easter message on the radio.

Your twist and old and done, The Observer. How would you feel if during Christmas time you saw nothing but Muslim decor or maybe only Jewish signs that said "while we feel Jesus had a lot of good things to say, he is not the Messiah"

And don't give me the line "well we are a Christian nation" either.

Lastly...before you go down this route either (I'm just heading you off the pass). Not having an overpriced Nativity scene in a mall is going to stop you from being less of a Christian or restrict your ability to celebrate Christmas.

How would you feel if during Christmas time you saw nothing but Muslim decor or maybe only Jewish signs that said "while we feel Jesus had a lot of good things to say, he is not the Messiah"

I wouldn't care. I'm a tolerant agnostic.

oops...I let my anger get the best of me (because in the Christian realm, I hear this a bunch). MY bad for jumping the gun on you.

> How come Atheists complain about Christmas decorations in a shopping mall? Don't they honor diversity?

Didn't you get the memo? Christmas decorations stifle diversity! It is only wrong to get offended if you are white or Christian or male or some combo of the above.

Here are some other examples of athiests supporting free speech and diversity by boycotting places with fish symbols and and biblical passages:

Seriously though... Every group contains some people who are easily offended. Why is it only somehow wrong when it's a Christian that's offended? Why is it even news?

Why is it only somehow wrong when it's a Christian that's offended?

Because the things (that make the news) that Christians get offended about is absurd. I mean come on, a coffee cup saying?

You want to know what offends me as a Christian? I'm offended that there is not enough help for the homeless and the poor. I'm offended that a Christian seminary fired all of it's female professors strictly on the base of sex. I'm offended that I hear Christians tell off colored n-word jokes in private...and laugh about it.

It is only wrong to get offended if you are white or Christian or male or some combo of the above.

Oh please. I'm a white Christian male and I've never experienced this. You know, the Conservative sect of our society calls liberals "whiny." But I sure to do see a lot of whining spewing out of their mouths (and before you place me in a left/right camp. I consider myself to be NEITHER)

But I sure to do see a lot of whining spewing out of their mouths

that meaning the conservatives, not the liberals

I think we all generalize too much. Let's not be so sure this woman represents all Christians any more than "squeaky wheel atheists" represent all atheists.

> Because the things (that make the news) that Christians get offended about is absurd. I mean come on, a coffee cup saying?

There's the problem. Why did it make the news in the first place?

She just represents all crazy Christians.

> I think we all generalize too much. Let's not be so sure this woman represents all Christians any more than "squeaky wheel atheists" represent all atheists.

Agreed. So why do we promote stuff like this article, which only serves to reinforce stereotypes?

How often do atheists complain about decorations in a mall, as opposed to, say, government property? Again, people are mixing up these issues. Most disputes between atheists and Christians involve direct discrimination or involve the government.

Shopping Malls in the United Arab Emirates are loaded with x-mas decorations (at x-mas time, it's not some kind of esl induced misplaced marketing thing).

Why?

Because the UAE, like the rest of the Gulf, is full of Fillipinos and other Christian guest workers and the shopping malls want to sell them stuff because that's what shopping malls do.

Now, having said that, I've yet to see a shopping mall, or any other retail setting, that wasn't plastered with x-mas decorations from October well into the new year.

What athiestic dystopia are you shopping in?

yes you are 100% right but as she is a Christian, she could have put your energies elsewhere. It's my personal opinion that if Jesus were around he would not have whined to the media over something like that.

She had a right to complain about it to the media, and people seem upset that see exercised her right.

Observer, I don't care that she complained to the media. But why did the media publish?
2 possibilities occur to me. Perhaps there was nothing else to publish that day, or maybe the media organisation is a bit Christian fundementalist.
BTW, why did she keep the cup for the photo, I wonder?

yes you are 100% right but as she is a Christian, she could have put your energies elsewhere.

And Newdow, as an Atheist, could have put his energies elsewhere!

if Jesus were around he would not have whined to the media over something like that.

Right. He would have busted out the whip, knocked over all the tables (the ones not bolted down at least) and cast out all the employees.

But Brian, Jesus is here, or at lease Jesus-Hulk is! And Jesus-Hulk will knock over those bolted down tables as well.

I can never think of Myk the same way again...

And Newdow, as an Atheist, could have put his energies elsewhere!

Actually, atheists don't claim to believe in a book that commands them to do good things, so no, there's technically no hypocrisy in an atheist not helping people.

We're not the ones who eagerly claim to eat, sleep, and go potty on the divinely given moral pedestal.

I just bring my own cup! :)

Next we'll have hard core conservatives complaining that the recycle symbol on the paper cups are offensive to them as anti-environmentalists...

I just think we should go just go ahead and use Orwell's NEWSPEAK and just be done with it...that's the way we are heading now anyway. And it's not one particular group that's driving us there either, it's all groups that keep tightening their grip on "words" and "sayings" either by restricting them or abusing them.

This is similar to stores saying "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas" when you enter/leave a store. I worked at Target for a while and we had this one lady who wrote several letters to the editor of our local paper because our signs read "Happy Holidays" and our cashiers didn't say "Merry Christmas". Starbucks, for once, has a great idea in doing this. Sparking controversy is great and although it won't change that lady's view, at least she has something to think about while drinking her coffee... and if not her then someone else.

Doesn't it feel wonderful to be open-minded?

*God* forbid anything be said that's non-PC that breaks out of the grey zone of public neutrality by a publically-traded company. Sheesh.

Well, it's news because it touches on a core issue we actually care about: @!$%#ing about Starbucks :)

nor am I surprised by the outpouring of Christian-hating here on newsvine.

But that's just it, it's hateful Christians that warrant the negativity. If the "squeaky wheel" Christians were putting their energies to something worthwhile (and not being so vocal about it), then would probably be less adverse reactions.

If squeaky wheel Christians would get this "everyone's out to prosecute me and take away my toys" chip off their shoulder and start, say, being...oh I don't know...more LOVING, then I'd say the hate would die down. I bet you don't hear people say "man, I hate it guy...he's so kind and giving." Or things like "oh here comes Carl, better watch out...he might forgive you"

Growing up I heard pastors and Christians say "now when you represent Christ, you're going to get persecuted and made fun of it." You know, I've found that to be totally untrue. I am a Christian, follow Christ and I'm not under "constant persecution." But when I do get some form of persecution, it's usually from another Christian. Man sometimes we're our own worst enemy.

I don't believe that anyone is hating Christians for their viewpoints and crticism of this issue. I really don't think this lady was rational in making a scene about the issue at hand. The minority of people who make situations like this major tend to want to push their viewpoints on others, but Starbucks is clearly not doing that to her.

This lady clearly wants Starbucks to say sorry or censor these quotes. Although many may not agree with what is being said that is no reason for Starbucks to stop making these cups. Dialogue should be created and I think everyone would be a better person for it. (Like we see here on Newsvine)

nor am I surprised by the outpouring of Christian-hating here on newsvine.

I'd like a grande cup of Christian hating with a shot of parody please. Yes, with whipped cream, duh.

But that's just it, it's hateful Christians that warrant the negativity.

How exactly was this hateful?

If the "squeaky wheel" Christians were putting their energies to something worthwhile (and not being so vocal about it), then would probably be less adverse reactions.

In other words, seen but not heard?

How exactly was this hateful?

I meant "in general"

In other words, seen but not heard?

In the hopes I'm not setting myself up for a verbal smackdown, yes I think it more christians (including myself) were DOING (something worthwhile...and I'm not talking about someone holding a sign on the road that says "god hates fags") instead of RANTING, then yeah...I would wager some adversity towards christians would die down.

sthig,

Throughout this thread there's this weird assumption that the woman doesn't do anything but complain about her Starbucks cup.

We don't have any idea what her life is like, aside from this boneheaded moment (and in the spirit of Christian magnamity we should forgive, no?)

She could be a saint and spend her days working with Appalachian poor (even though that's quite a drive from Dayton). She could be a school teacher. She could be a crackhead...

We just don't know.

Brooding,

I was referring to her incident of complaining about the coffee cup and not outside of that. I never said she was a no good crack head (but let's face it, people who complain about cups are no-good crackheads...j/k) but the way she and the media has portrayed it is that she's gone to a lot of trouble to complain about something trifling when she could have used that energy elsewhere.

Yeah, she could be another Mother Theresa, but I'd even bite Mama T's head off too if she'd complained about a coffee cup.

You know, I meant "Christian-hating" in the same vein as "playa-hating"; I was just making reference to the Arsenio-style dogpound of folks at the vine who jump at any chance to slam fundies.

I still don't think it's wrong to just want coffee-flavored coffee with no culture/behavior programming messages on the packaging. Starbucks shouldn't be required to change anything, but they shouldn't be surprised (or offended) if it turns people off.

Please see my note of clarification above. Don't hate the playa, hate the game.