The Truth Behind Obama's Falling Approval Ratings - He's Up With Democrats, Up With Independents, and Rock-Bottom With Republicans

It's all in the words and propaganda slogans.

"Government take over of health care"

"Death panels"

"Kill grandma"

"Government take over of the auto industry"

"Government take over of the banks?

It's the words they use, and if it didn't work so well it'd actually be funny. But what really amazes me is how people buy into it. They don't see that these industries own many of our politicians and that they don't want things to change, they want things to stay statue quo, and why not? Well, it's because they're making boat loads of money off American citizens. And these citizens that are against our current President and screaming these specific talking points are truly intelligent people, but for some reason they continue to turn a blind eye to the manipulation of these industries with the help of our politicians.

Can a "Republican" be treated with penicillin, amoxicillan, or Cipro?

Just asking.

So basically the seeder is stating that the 51% of people who now disapprove of him are all Republicans. Maybe it was that all of the people polled for this particular poll was taken from the demographic of Americans who work for a living.

So having an approval rating of 47% from independents is good?

Amen. Does that mean we have ridden our republic of those liberal vermin?

Tom-- enough with the eliminationist rhetoric. It isn't helping.

Do you really want to convince Americans to listen to the conservative viewpoint? Do you believe you have something important to say? Denigrating half the country's population and describing them as "vermin" is not the way to do so... nor the way to get people to listen to you.

However, if you truly believe that we are all "vermin", well, I've got a proposition for you: contact me, and I'll give you my address. You're welcome to come over and try to "get rid" of me...

I campaigned and voted for President Obama.

I was spit on and screamed at in my small Midwestern town while carrying yard signs for Obama.

And, I am starting to lose faith in President Obama.

Brandon I also supported Obama but I still do, he is facing obstructionists and vandals at every turn and his answer is, pragmatism. I am going to wait to see what gets done in the first two years and then I will reassess.

Brandon- I am sorry. I know what that feels like and it is not a nice thing. I was very young when it happened, but disillusionment is never pleasant. Unfortunately, many of us knew this would happen with this prez- there was nowhere to go but down. Now he is no longer a star- start governing. The days of 'well I won so I don't need you' are over. This is when you will see the true mettle of the man. Governing is an exercise in concensus building, and this president has dismissed half the country because he felt he won and that was that. His win was far from a landslide, though he claimed a mandate and has thus far conducted himself as if he had the Reagan landslide.

and WmAllen, you have made an excellent point. Now I wonder if you will go back through these posts and post that same message to all the liberals calling conservatives morons, and bigots, and inbred, and bible thumpers, idiots, idealogues- well you get the point. I am for serious discussion- we have serious things to talk about, but your side is at least as guilty as mine.

eliminationalist rhetoric?

It was a joke. Some photos (link below) for you WmAllen of SOH (Dem) Nancy Pelosi's district that she knew about and obviously agreed with since she never uttered a word of denunciation or disapproval. Since Move on.org was organizing alot of these rallies and they have a political symbiotic relationship with Ms. Speaker, she shares culpability for hatemongering and elimintionalist rhetoric in spades. No fuzzy math here:. Liberals=hypocrites.

And btw I enjoyed the toughguy internet invitation personna.

http://www.zombietime.com/zomblog/?p=612

he is facing obstructionists and vandals at every turn and his answer is, pragmatism.

Blayde,

he doesn't need the Rep - he can do whatever he wants as they have a majority in both Houses...so if he doesn't get it passed, who, then, are the obstructionists - his fellow Dem who don't march lock step with him ? That's the only logical conclusions one can come to.

The vandals and thieves are in ALL leadership positions of our government -from the White House on down! They are stealing our hard earned dollars now and for many future generations to give it to whom they want, when they want, and how they want - to the tune of more than a trillions dollars of debt in just 9 months, 17,000 earmarks in the two main bills last spring, with more vote buying tax dollars down the toilet in this monstrosity of a healthcare bill.

I think Brandon, a Democrat, who voted for him and campaigned for him, pretty much summed it up - he is losing faith in him as are many democrats and independents - this numbers game this seeder claims is about as goofy as this ADM 's saying that they created 650,000 jobs through the stimulus - lying, deceitful, and fraudulent!

My neighbors pet tortoise had an Obama Campaign symbol painted on it's shell.

The other day they found him upside down, dead from trying to scratch the paint off of his shell. A tragedy even in the reptilian testudinae family.

Steph, there are idiots on both sides, I never said there weren't. But I do think that the rhetoric from the one side has had a more strident, violent undercurrent of late. And when was the last time a far-leftie shot up a church, museum, police officer or gym?

To hear the tone of some of the media pundits these days, you'd think that sort of thing was what they wanted (what with the seccession, "time for a revolution", &c &c &c)...

And Tom, in regards to your post, I didn't find it amusing. Is it OK for you to do this sort of thing, because "they did it first"? That excuse didn't work well for you when you were five, why do you think it will work now?

The tactical playbook I have been studying is from Rules For Radicals. Are you familiar with it? What we Yankees in Maine call it is "turn around is fair play".

Wm. did you agree or decry with the tone, spirit, chants and signage wielded by liberals protesting the previous administration?

WmA There are alot of inappropriate comments on both sides, and I never said otherwise. I suspect you notice the right wing stuff more because it is heard as other from the beginning. I had the same feeling about things said about GWB and Cheney ( some still being said) so no, I don't think one side is worse than the other. The revolutions I have heard called for have all been political, and centered on the next two elections. It has only ever been the left in my lifetime who have fomented violent protests, killing people in ELF or the protests in the 60s the world bank protests etc. The bible thumpers, not so much.

ROTFLMAO, only an obdurate obscurantist would deny Obama's bleeding of support from independents over the past eight months from 65% approval to 45% disapproval which is the majority in the latter plurality.

Bill, you are right. They seem to have a problem knowing the difference between up and down. When his strongly approve numbers are 26% and his strongly dissaprove numbers are 41% (-15), the Independents are not up with Obama.

Over here in NJ we now have (thankfully) a Republican Governor!!! and in Virginia they have Republicans in office as well!! The majority of the Independents and disillusioned Dems all voted Republican in NJ and Virginia. I see this as a good sign of our nation waking up from the libera/democrat nightmare.

This seed is so blatantly dishonest intellectually that I'm reporting it as "inaccurate".

The tactical playbook I have been studying is from Rules For Radicals. Are you familiar with it? What we Yankees in Maine call it is "turn around is fair play".

Good stuff my friend! :) I've been trying to post that as much as possible bringing up the strategy for people to understand. Maybe, it is rubbing off on you a little?

I think the results of any poll are going to be consistent with the positions of who is funding the poll.

its an outlier which makes the data suspicious

thats why i like realclearpolitics.com because they average many polls data so you don't get the wild outliers such as this that make people believe something that is not accurate

and even on RCP, their averages are sometimes suspect as well as they include 2 week old data in their averages. much can change in a two week period.

stats are fickle things and looking at as much data as possible is best. touting outliers as solid data is not the best way to use statistics (from either side of the aisle)

Amen, my brother was a staunch democrat as was his wife both are so disappointed with Obama and the entire Democratic Congress they regret their votes.

Why are there so many signs out there from the election that supported Obama that now have the red circle with the line through it and the words "I am sorry" written underneath?

I think when they did this poll they were probably parked in an area that supported a democratic slant to the poll and what about the pollsters if they disagreed with what someone said they just checked what they did agree with....I am done believing polls posted by a questionable media. I see the polls on Aol which is large cross section and the polls there do not lend credence to any approval to Obama or the healthplan.

my brother was a staunch democrat as was his wife both are so disappointed with Obama and the entire Democratic Congress they regret their votes.

I'm also disappointed with President Obama and the Congress, both Republican and Democrats. However, in no way do I regret my vote. I have to be rational and tell myself that it's only been 10 months, we can't expect miracles. It's also very hard to get anything done with all the back and forth fighting and lies.

This particular poll was only taken over 5 states, which were all blue if memory serves, though not by much- so it really doesn't matter- neither would it matter if it were a nationwide poll, the state by state tally determines the EC-and I think there are the beginnings of change- but it is too soon to tell. State by state, show me red going blue or vice versa then I will say we are changing our collective mind.

Not hardly- AR 2nd is the people's republic of Little Rock, and MO is a slight swing, VA will prob go back to Red- but NC and WI are you kidding me??

So Mo was actually narrowly red, but is up in the air this year. VA was blue by as much of a margin as most blue states, and will probably go back red NC surprises me, I thought it was more heavily dem than that- I knew Clinton went down there to campaign for bo. WI is safe- if they would elect Al Franken, but then look who they were running against. But yes, AR is a fairly blue state that is trending red- Lincoln is in trouble there.

also they never listed sample size or how it was conducted- especially if they used cell phones or not etc.

profchaos,

I agree with your statement.

I also find it hard to believe that ALL Democrats are happy with Obama and especially the Independents!

Who or What took this "survey"?

real clear politics gives great data - they take each poll ( right, left, and center) and give it to you - ALL of it, then they average it together. I don't know why Killfile is slamming RCP (then again, yes, I do, because it doesn't fit the template of what he wants), but RCP is the most unbiased of all of them...

good one killfile!!! Happy Turkey to you and yours!

Happy Thanksgiving to you too, Killfile.

My dad always said, "Liars figure, and figures lie." I think this data is skewed - it simply does not match up with the other polling data that I have seen out there. He's losing support from all sides (the Rep are no surprise, as they weren't on board with him to begin with so a 20+ percent drop can't just be Rep...it doesn't even make sense)...

And with Obama's speech on Tuesday about the Afghanistan war and us "finishing the job", as he's eluded to, look for more of the anti-war left to start up a "Hillary in 2012" campaign.

Waynester:

Only a fool would want to be associated with the loony bin which used to be the GOP.

BKT.

As usual, your statement of pure opinion has no particular relevance to the subject at hand. And btw, according to Rasmussen the Republicans currently have a lead of 7 points in the generic congressional ballot poll.

Waynester:

As usual, your statement of pure opinion has no particular relevance to the subject at hand.

What are you, six years old?

Waynester:

What are you, six years old?

P.S. There is many a slip between the cup and the lip!

Why do you insist on showing every one who reads your posts just how asinine and immature you really are?

It's a good time for all, except you, of course.

Lighten up.

Despite your polls and predictions of the downfall of the Democratic Party in 2010, 2012, or 3016 life will continue.

You will continue to spin reality as you see fit, and I will be in the third row making faces and fart noises, undermining all you say.

It's just the natural way of things.

Happy Thanksgiving.

Mindlessly repeating what others say (like a six year old) isn't particularly entertaining to anyone except you and possibly a few others with the same proximate maturity level.

You will continue to spin reality as you see fit,

Unlike you, I posted links containing actual data from reliable posters that shed light on the current political landscape. Calling it "spin" doesn't help your credibility, such as it is, in the least.

Unlike you, I have bigger fish to fry than my credibility on some online blog.

By the way Waynester, I am quite confident that it is not the minority opinion that you are not qualified to shed light on any landscape, particularly one as ever changing as the political one.

Time will tell the tale.

I have bigger fish to fry than my credibility on some online blog.

I agree that your credibility is indeed fried.

I am quite confident that it is not the minority opinion that you are not qualified to shed light on any landscape,

I'm not shedding light, the info that I and others have linked to is. Credible info, not from some obscure (presumably leftist) polling outfit of which few have ever heard.

You just got a vote Killfile. That trousertrout guy was a pain in my posterior.

THe use of "no value" is certainly appropriate in BKT's case.

Actually, Waynester, the true test would be, district by district, to replace that "generic' conservative with a name...

Is there anyone on the stage who is a viable conservative candidate? I certainly haven't seen much that's worthwhile in the GOP lately...

Actually, Waynester, the true test would be, district by district, to replace that "generic' conservative with a name...

True enough WM, but it is an indication of the falling fortunes of Democrats lately.

Is there anyone on the stage who is a viable conservative candidate? I certainly haven't seen much that's worthwhile in the GOP lately...

As far as the presidential election goes it's still way early; the generic poll has important implications for the Congressional elections next year.

Kasich 2012- Flat tax , baby

doctorsteph, I would go for a flat tax, if there were no possibility for deductions and no loopholes, then the wealthiest people would carry the burden, just like they are supposed to. A flat tax won't happen.

I am good with the flat tax - everybody has skin in the game...and NO loopholes- flat tax is a flat tax....eliminate the income tax and just have a single flat tax - maybe a national sales tax.

Blayde- disagree- I am for a flat tax in progressive form, FLAT referring to no loops no deductions- 10/15/30 would get us out of debt tout suite!! and, we would all pay attention to government again not just say gimmee.

Vol- exactly- everybody pays something- NO credits/deductions/loopholes AND all income ( bonuses too AIG et al) is taxed even money you get for dong movies, and playing sports....

totally agree.

it is an indication of the falling fortunes of Democrats lately...the generic poll has important implications for the Congressional elections next year...

I'm not too sure about that-- the only poll that ever makes any real difference is the one that happens on the Tuesday after the first Monday in November, after all. Besides, as you noted, it's way early-- a snapshot of attitudes twelve months out from the election cannot possibly take all the contingencies into account. Using today's poll to say "we're going to win in the future" is about as accurate as reading tea leaves or rooting around in the entrails of a pig. What happens if and when the economy turns around? What about the effect of future decisions by both parties, future successes and future failures? What happens if there is more carpet-bagging interference in district-level politics at the expense of local concerns, as was seen recently in the NY congressional race?

When asked these questions by a pollster, I usually answer that I voted for Obama, but am not fully satisfied with his performance thus far. That doesn't mean that I am now against him, do not support him, or regret my vote-- just that there are issues where I would like him to take a stronger stance, issues where I believe action should have been pursued more quickly, and times where I feel the only proper response from the PotUS would be an NCIS-Agent-Gibbs-style smack upside the head to some of the other folks in Washington (it won't ever happen, but one can dream...).

Neither does it mean that given the options, and my personal history and situation vis-a-vis the GOP platform and ideology, I will automatically be voting for Obama's opposition. They have done very little for (and quite a bit against) my personal situation and economic advantage over the last forty years or so... and nothing that has been said or proposed in the months since the election leads me to believe that all of a sudden the GOP will change and be more in line with my concerns any time soon...

I certainly realize what is happening. I doubt you do, but I most certainly do. Historical poll numbers clearly show that "IT'S THE ECONOMY, STUPID". Poll numbers go as does the economy. For example, that Republican paragon, Ronald Reagan sank as low as 35% as the economy worsened in 83. Same happened to Bush I and Clinton. And, as far as how popular a Pres needs to be to get re-elected, the number seems to be around 45% and up depending upon his competition.

In sum, the polls do not support any interpretation that Obama is in any real trouble at this juncture. In fact, this far from the election, history clearly shows that poll ratings are irrelevant. The only thing that matters is his poll numbers right before election and how he polls versus the competition. And that largely depends on the economy at that point.

As such, all of the blather from both left and right over Obama's poll numbers are just that - blather. So, have fun and blather away, but realize that what happens will likely have no connection to what is happening today.

hvymtl83

Good points.

I think the recent poll showing that the public is shifting the blame for the recession is great insight into your general point. The factors which led up to the recession haven't changed, the party in power for most of this decade hasn't changed, but the individual who is now responsible for all of those past transgressions shoulders the brunt of the load.

It's common sense. regardless of how we got here, this mess is certainly Obama's now and he will be judged by it. If the economy improves, his ratings will improve. When unemployment turns (as it historically does 12 to 18 months after economic 'bottom out'), his ratings will improve.

It wouldn't surprise me at all to see him up around 55% again by August of 2010 if there are no foreign attacks on home soil.

Jarrod,

It's not even that they are shifting the blame. The average joe doesn't care who caused what, they only know the pain they're feeling. Reagan had the same problem. Didn't matter that Nixon, Ford and Carter's policies eventually caused runaway inflation, they only knew that the economy was bad. Simple rule of thumb: When the economy is bad, the guy is a goat. When it's good he's a hero.

Healthcare is one of the biggest causes of people feeling insecure about their money and homes.

I agree with your general point but our economy simply can't be turned over night. It would have taken a literal Messiah to have the economy in the black numbers 10 months into a term.

jarrod, I know it would take a miracle if the economy were fixed in ten months. That is not my point. People are losing their homes, their jobs, and putting food on their credit cards just to eke by. The greedy banks, and Wall Street are reaping the benefits of the needy, and laughing at us as they sit in their multi-million dollar estates. I don't think anyone out there wants to wait 'til 2011 to start regulating the banks and their corpulent greed. For ten months now, Obama could have done something to stop their raping of America.

We might be poor, hungry, and living under a bridge, but by Heaven we might be healthy by 2011, if we can afford it.

Sorry, but I am passionate over this. :-)

I don't think anyone out there wants to wait 'til 2011 to start regulating the banks and their corpulent greed. For ten months now, Obama could have done something to stop their raping of America.

I couldn't agree more. This is one instance where I would like to see Obama and congressional democrats ram through financial banking regulation no matter how big of a fit congressional Republicans throw. Everyone was in agreement 12 months ago on what the problem was.

Sure, Dems were blaming Reps for lack of regulation (history of de-regulation) and reps were blaming Dems for lack of regulation (Clinton signing Gramm-Leach). The common denominator was 'lack of regulation'. Now however, congressional Republicans are pulling a complete 180 and espousing that too much regulation is the problem and the federal government needs to be completely hands off. Unfortunately, just enough democrats are being steered by financial special interests and it appears that all of the Republicans are as well, so we seem stuck in a do-nothing quagmire.

It's quite disgusting actually.

I believe the push for healthcare reform came out of a desire to get ahead of legislative inertia. For really big changes it's best to try to tackle them first instead of waiting for a time to "settle in" before addressing them. Effective CEO's do the same thing when they come into their position in a company...make the sweeping changes right off the bat before the rank and file can institutionalize their resistance.

Division

Great point.

Strongly disagree/ The push for Health Care reform came form one of Obama's promises that he would do something and do it the first year. He is putting aside the most important issue of the moment which is getting the economy back on track and getting jobs because he needs the good press the Health Care issue could give him. What is a bit funny is that his own party has contributed to this not going forward as much as the Republicans have. The focus now and what should have been since Day 1 was the economy- it has not been so. It has been talking point Government at its worst and too many people are paying the price.

bibi- - - -because its not about health care. . . . . . its about CONTROL

Yuck yuck yuck.

Bighorn, the Dems and the lamestream media can metaphorically polish a turd but it's still a turd and all of the perfume in the world will not keep it from it's inevitable aromatic foulness.

That was FM at klondike51212. Next caller please.

Don't forget- as of last Friday, according to Diane Rehm and NPR it is 'blasphemy' to criticize Obama.

which conservatives consider GWB a failed presidency?? Not many- we may not tell you that, so we aren't called all sortds of names on NV- but we don't consider him failed. There are things we wish he had done differently.

Maybe not on newsvine boards, but privately I used to hear it all the time from conservatives (other than neocons) as a way of saying "I'm different, don't blame me". Maybe now that he's not in office people will identify with him more, but it didn't used to be that way.

I haven't ever heard failed presidency from anyone except a lib. And I hang with a big ole bunch of conservatives!!

I haven't ever heard failed presidency from anyone except a lib. And I hang with a big ole bunch of conservatives!!

Uh, yeah, that's the fear factor-peer pressure thing, you probably won't hear that in a big group. They felt it necessary to confide in me. This includes a current Republican member of congress and a staffer. Just saying...

well, maybe they were trying to fit in with you? I don't know people are pretty two faced I suppose.

Uuuuhhhhh Whats so darn special about Ivy League grads? I wouldn't send my kids to Harvard/Yale if my life depended on it. I prefer they be returned to me American human beings myself.

After all, Gates is a scholar LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLLOOLOLOLOLOL!!!!!!!!!!

Weve had about enough Ivy Leaguers run the country into the ground don't you think? Lets try an American from the Big 10, Pac 10 or any ten. Please

you know- how about Truman- did he even go to college?? He did a pretty good job of cleaning up after Roosevelt

Weve had about enough Ivy Leaguers run the country into the ground don't you think? Lets try an American from the Big 10, Pac 10 or any ten. Please

Actually, it's all about the Big 12!

LOL! please do. Anyone for a second ammendment rally 1/15/10 on the DC mall???? Lets try to meet them there, after all maybe now we can get coverage on more than FOX. Mainstream media focusing on us??? Puleeez. There is no hate, ignorance, or fear- that's Olberman/Maddow on the cable channel without ratings.

Thank you Steph for confirming to the rest of us what we worried that some conservatives really think of their fellow Americans.

LOL @ "Progressive, Moderate, Independents, and thinking folks." Um, progressives only value the input of those that agree with them. So cross many of the moderate, indepenent and thinking folks off your list.

Lately they aren't even agreeing with one another. The only thing they agree on is that George Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Limbaugh, Beck and Palin are Satan. The phenomenon known as voter's remorse is now proliferating among the ranks of independents who voted as a referendum against Bush and liberals who thought Obama was the second coming.

As Gomer Pyle used to say, "surprise, surprise, surprise, gollllyyyyyyyy".

Wow, Gomer Pyle...I love how conservatives make hokey references to an America that doesn't exist anymore to somehow seem more genuine. ANYHOW, the reason you see "fighting" amongst progressives is because they have differeing opinions (shock) unlike the far right, which teaches that "only one way is best and you'd better follow or get out of the way".

Sorry Cap- but it is too delicious to hear the plaintiff wail of the poooor widdle wiwerals who are being so discriminated against because the lamestream media has focused on the conservatives? Please, if you bite that apple there will be a worm in it.

"I love how conservatives make hokey references to an America that doesn't exist anymore"

Said captamerica. Does anyone else see the irony?

Oh brother lol!!!!

Cappy, actually if you read Edward Klein's book called The Truth About Hillary, you'll find that when Senator Hillary Clinton first met Bill Clinton, she commented that he sounded like Gomer Pyle, to a friend. He looked like a hippie war protester and sounded like Jim Nabors, famous country bumpkin character. Imagine that.

yeah, have a big rally in DC! Now that's a hoot - like Denver, that's even more funny!

I know around here, lots of the Obama yard signs are disappearing ... they are too ashamed to have them out now from the ones I have talked with. So have your rally- maybe on a good day you can get 1000 people who aren't too ashamed to align themselves with the driver of the bus headed toward the cliff...

Hilarious!

BTW, Obama makes me wish for the days GWB was in the WH.

so vol- can we count you in?? 2nd amendment rally the same day???

I think that is a recipe for disaster -though I do pack legally, and am a wholehearted supporter of the 2nd Amendment... being that I used to live in the DC burbs, I promised myself I wouldn't go back there for love nor money - no desire to go...and no money either!

I don't think its a recipe for disaster- though it is tongue in cheek. Were we to use this site to advertise a political rally we would be collapsed and suspended.

I have seen MANY notes about tea parties rallys on newsvine that were not taken down. Bring your guns and come as opposition - we don't care. We still live in America and those of us who voted for and support our President still live here in the millions. We are simply wanting to show that support.

You and the others who 'think' like you do, have a different opinion. So be it. See you in Washington on the 15th of January then.

Marked as rude nasty and advertising.

BTW- guns are illegal in DC aren't they?

Not anymore! The USSC has finally stated what we knew all along to be true, that gun ownership is an individual right. Anytime the phrase "the right of the people"is in the constitution, it refers to an individual right. Didn't the 15th ammendment apply the bill of rights to the states as well?

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/obama_administration/daily_presidential_tracking_poll how President Obama is losing independent voters , health care reform, the President's approval ratings

there are so few of us, lol, and the libs are so strong. We just don't have achance, do we. We might as well not even try to field candidates in the next election. No the dems/libs have nothing to fear from us. These are not the droids you are looking for.

ged

I hope you're right, let's get this thing done !

ok, guess I would look at it differently. If Obama is down in the polls, he is only good for campaigns in very blue states. Kind of like he helped in NJ, I mean Virginia- oh well, you know blue states. That being the case, they can't vote FOR the bill when BO can't help them at home.

The Democrats chess pieces are placed perfectly. They now just have to follow thru with the rest of the game.

Pass health care and let employment rise naturally with the improving economy. By the next congressional election the game will be won.

that's a good one! You are really funny.

My 401(k) is up 40 percent since January.

Hysterical....

Well, the American people may not be hysterical, but they are happy about their 401(k).

you crack me up!!!

"My 401(k) is up 40 percent since January." Nobody's is up that much from January unless they took incredible risks our are overweighted in gold. Now if you'd said up 40% since March, I would have believed you as the Dow is up about 4,000 points from it's lows. It was around 9600 when Obama was elected, 8500 when he took office, and sank to 6400+ before rising to tofays 10,400 plus. The problem is that we know if democrat political objectives are reached and the tax cuts are all repealled, by March 2011, we'll be right back at March 2009 levels.

exactly Ch- it cannot be true- must be a joke....

Actually doc, he probably has Martha Stewart's broker.

good one!!!

The Dow is up 60 percent since the March low.

I switched to treasury bonds when whe the market was tanking under Bush. In mid March switched back to the market.

gedanken,

How many of your bluechip companies are partially owned or are having government controls placed upon them currently? How many of these are being overvalued? We are currently dealing with the same Security Exchange Commission that turned a blind eye to the stupidity of the last few years.

We have the best schools and the smartest engineers, scientists, and entrepreneurs.

America's haters have a bad track record.

All you are saying, is give BO a chance. Hmm, NO

Everyone should give President Obama a chance, heck he's only been in office now for a year and it takes at least three years for any new President to get anything going.

Huh? Reagan was in office for 9 months and the economy was turned around and moving in a positive direction as soon as the American people acknowledged that they had a good leader. Reagan "inherited" 21% interest rates, 15%+ unemployment, 12% annual inflation, etc. and the United States was demoralized and our national prestige was tanking. 21 million new jobs within 7 years and the longest peacetime economic growth in the history of America.

How he get it done? Doing the opposite of just about everything President Obama is currently doing.

You talk of Regan's beginning, I'll talk about his end:

October 19th', 1987--Black Monday. In just six hours, the Dow Jones Industrial Average of 30 Blue Chip stocks fell 508 points. In those days that was a fall of 23 per cent. By any measure, it was Wall Street's worst day ever.

Regan screwed things up, that is diametrically opposed to what Obama is doing.

Two elements relating to 1987; dispute in monetary policy within the G7 and Program Trading. Also a phenomenon that many refer to as black swan.

Hong Kong started off the tumble and lost around 43% stock value if I remember right before it whacked Europe, the U.S. and then Canada.

Cool, thanks for the black swan theory, I'll shoot that one right off to Bush so that he can use that in defense of his failed economic ability. My brother knew what was happening and sold most of his stock right before Black Monday (against his stock brokers advice), I guess it wasn't such a fluke after all.

It isn't that people cannot be in the right place at the right time, and yes many people have benifitted from black swans throughout history, but the 87 tumble was about many things- not insignificantly, was about a changing worldwide economy. And the stock market is always a bit of a gamble- good for your brother that he bet right!